Sad

[=tom=]

Tuesday, 2 November, 2004

Gunman kills Dutch film director
Dutch film maker Theo van Gogh
Van Gogh directed TV series and wrote newspaper columns
Dutch film maker Theo van Gogh, who made a controversial film about Islamic culture, has been stabbed and shot dead in Amsterdam, Dutch police say.

Police arrested a man (Morocco) in a nearby park after an exchange of gunfire.

Van Gogh, 47, had received death threats after his film Submission, on violence against women in Islamic societies, was shown on Dutch TV.

The film was made with liberal Dutch politician Ayaan Hirsi Ali, a Somali refugee who fled an arranged marriage.

Ayaan Hirsi Ali has been under police protection since the film was aired. She has also received death threats and has renounced the Islamic faith.

Ayaan Hirsi Ali
Ayaan Hirsi Ali is an outspoken critic of Islam

Eyewitnesses quoted by Radio Netherlands said Van Gogh was attacked while cycling by a man dressed in a traditional Moroccan jallaba.

Both the suspect and a policeman suffered bullet wounds and are now in hospital.

Van Gogh - who was related to the famous Dutch painter - had also been making a film about Pim Fortuyn, the populist right-wing, anti-immigration politician assassinated in May 2002.



:( ....................

[ZiEk.]

I know :(

rust in vrede...

[Chairwalker]

Not to sound like an ******* here, but i didnt know the guy personally.
So his death doesnt really do anything to me. Must be bad for the family, but i dont know any of them either.
The reason behind his death does make me mad, though.

It just pisses me off when people pull a stunt like this. I'm no saint, but whenever i get angry i dont claim that i'm right or that there's reasoning behind my anger. I just break stuff.
If the murderer had just said he thought Van Gogh was an *******, i wouldnt have thought of him any lesser. But this whole "my religion/culture is better, so i'm going to kill you now" stuff is just plain silly.

And then there's the morons who keep blubbering about how "all muslims are evil" and such crap, they're no better.

I guess there's alot of people who like to belong to a certain group just so they can rip on the other groups.
Well thats good for them, but why all the bull****?
Dont say you did it for Allah or Adolf or God or whoever you kill for, just say you felt like shooting someone.

Blah

[deegs]

under islamic law he was in the right to kill van go

[ZiEk.]

today even saw a marocan kid sayin van gogh was playin with fire n now he got burned.

Them fool should go to school more often n learn somethin other then bull****.

**** is f*cked up in here, van gogh nevr shot nobody n ima against killin.

I love shooting at you guys tho :D

[Chairwalker]

under islamic law he was in the right to kill van go

Damnit Deegs thats just what i mean.
You just blurt a heavy statement like that without knowing jack-**** about it.

According to muslims, blood is unpure and those who have blood on their hands can never worship allah again or something like that.
The problem is that certain ****ed up..ehh 'islam priest guys' (dont know the word) are spreading the word that if you kill in allah's name and die by doing so, you're a great hero and the killing you just did isnt a bad thing. wich is, ofcourse, bull**** if you know the facts.
And im not even a muslim, im just a guy who digs mythology and theology.

[Sneaky]

I honestly don't believe that people who do this sort of thing are truly religious. The actual teachings of Islam (though I'm not Islamic myself) don't encourage wanton violence, unless I'm mistaken.

[Chairwalker]

Yeah thats basicly what im trying to say, too.

[=DavikKang=]

Read the Koran and the Hadieth, you might discover something interesting regarding this subject. Also check out the Islamic law in the Middle Eastern countries. I just have to feel sorry for the women there.

[=tom=]

certain ****ed up..ehh 'islam priest guys' (dont know the word) .

Imam ?



According to muslims, blood is unpure and those who have blood on their hands can never worship allah again or something like that.
and especially not in the Rammadan (sp?) month

[Chairwalker]

Also check out the Islamic law in the Middle Eastern countries. I just have to feel sorry for the women there.

Yup, pretty crappy. But that's not because of their religion.
I mean, George Bush is pro death-penalty. But that doesnt mean that the death penalty is 'the christian way' right?
I've been told that the Koran doesnt say anything about wearing those silly burkas or anything. It's just enforced by stupid guys who're obsessed with their women cheating on 'em ;)

[Sneaky]

I guess there are good people in bad people in every religion. It's uncontrollable. Christians are constantly branded old-fashioned bigots but I know some very nice Christians willing to donate their lives and money to helping others. That's why, I hate it when someone brands a religion or the entire religious populace with one statement (I think someone said this earlier).

[Ender]

The interesting thing, from what I know, is that it seems like Buddhism is one of the few major religons that's rarely branded as evil.

[|_maPex_|]

Islamic culture != Islam the religion

In the religion it NOWHERE says anything about wanton violence except that it's bad etc etc. Some poorer Islamic countries however have traditions where women are to be more oppressed than the Koran or Muhammed himself have stated. It's not the religion but instead people executing the religion in a different way.

I'd rather not get into a discussion about religion, knowing some of the immaturity in the online gaming community. I'm just stating a valid, indisputable idea above and that's all. In fact, to prevent any racism or any flames we should stop this topic now. Tom's posting of the first post in this thread was enough to start up some emotions, and yes it sucks Tom.
But now hearing how you guys are arguing about it is slowly making it worse.

[Chairwalker]

I dont see how a healthy discussion can do any harm.

[deegs]

Damnit Deegs thats just what i mean.
You just blurt a heavy statement like that without knowing jack-**** about it.


I know quite a considerable amount of jack**** about the matter


Yup, pretty crappy. But that's not because of their religion.
I mean, George Bush is pro death-penalty. But that doesnt mean that the death penalty is 'the christian way' right?
I've been told that the Koran doesnt say anything about wearing those silly burkas or anything. It's just enforced by stupid guys who're obsessed with their women cheating on 'em ;)

Doesnt seem like ur to up to speed on the matter however ;)

[Chairwalker]

Doesnt seem like ur to up to speed on the matter however ;)

Explain.

[=tom=]

a ironic fact (chairwalker and ziek know already)
is that this assasination is excactly 911 days after Pim Fortuyn was killed

[deegs]

Explain.

But that's not because of their religion.
It is

I've been told that the Koran doesnt say anything about wearing those silly burkas or anything.
It advises women to be not seen by men, so therefore advises to cover up if they have to pass men

It's just enforced by stupid guys who're obsessed with their women cheating on 'em
Its not appreciated by 92% of the arab population but the 8% that do enforce it are 6% muslims and 2% mattah (dunno spelling but they are the religious police) who need to travel the kingdom with armed gaurds....the stroll thru the country shouting at ppl not following guidlines set about inthe koran and and can imprison/punish non conformanists (happened many a time to my mum due to her blone hair and blue eyes and pale skin she stood out like a sore thumb....you'd have these twats walk by shouting and the ex-pats would hide in a shop if the mattah spotted u they came into the shop and shouted at you or hit you, you couldnt talk/fight back as there were 2 armed gaurds with ak47's covering u.....you just did what they said pretty fast), they also make up the backbone of islamic law. this is only totally apparant in saudi arabia, the most fundamentally ruled arab country, also the birthplace to mohammad, and home to mecca.
Following in close pursuit is afganistan, iraq, iran etc.
In the majority of these countries the people dont wish the laws enforced to such a degree and also there are people that do wish to stick with tradition.
Arab countries like UAE, qatar, bahrain, turkey, that have had its natural resources gas/oil/tourism etc are more lenient and leave the matter up to your discretion.